KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Well, here's a video that sums the bike up perfectly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry2r0OoJnFQ
In summary, it's a very twisty mountain road on a sunny day, K1200GT, bloke riding and another bloke on the back holding a video camera, plus a scottie dog sitting on the tank (I kid ye not), and they are attacking this road like they are scratching up it on a sports bike, carrying more speed than I would in places (but I'm a coward), and all the while having a casual conversation uninterrupted by any wind noise...
And all that on a bike with shaft drive, cruise control, heated seats, lockable fairing pockets, an onboard computer and enough luggage capacity to swallow any amount of crap you can imagine.
I don't think there are many bikes that will do what the GT does in that video as well as it apparently does it, and then turn left onto a motorway at the end of the twisty road and give all three passengers a 500 mile comfortable, effort and ache free (assuming the dog doesn't get a sore arse from sitting on the tank) fast cruise home whatever the weather...
Oh, and I found that video after following a link to a BMW promo video of the K1300GT being scratched up a mountain road...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQ1R9Y29uFw
Top vid!
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Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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makka
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 13/05/2007
Posts: 2866
Loc: Jungle, Near Byron Bay, Austra...
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My old grandmother rides faster than that.
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makka
It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.
J. Krishnamurti
Never confuse who you are with what you do.
Makka
Zeitgeist
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clicker
journeyman
Reged: 16/12/2008
Posts: 88
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Try this one. Honda Goldwing, Deals Gap. The guy's getting his knee down!!..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nrMQ3QwyPo&feature=related
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makka
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 13/05/2007
Posts: 2866
Loc: Jungle, Near Byron Bay, Austra...
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that was my old gradmother.
It's a re-re-re-post.
An oldie but a goodie.
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makka
It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.
J. Krishnamurti
Never confuse who you are with what you do.
Makka
Zeitgeist
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adowds
old hand
Reged: 21/11/2006
Posts: 749
Loc: Croydon
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Hey Ken, you're back. Good.
I'm on the K1300GT launch in a fortnight. I almost hesitate to ask if you have any questions about the new 'un. But I will accept brief ones...
We're riding from Malaga to Faro, so a decent gig. The S and R will also be there to ride.
All assuming the 650GS story hasn't got me declared persona non grata of course...
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chappers
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 31/12/2006
Posts: 6701
Loc: Mind your own business
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Quote:
Hey Ken, you're back. Good.
I'll second that.
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Say what you think and think what you say.
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
Hey Ken, you're back. Good.
Nice to be back :-).
Quote:
I'm on the K1300GT launch in a fortnight. I almost hesitate to ask if you have any questions about the new 'un. But I will accept brief ones...
Ha! I'm happy with the one I have, which is good because I can't see me spending that kind of wedge on another bike anytime soon, especially one not very different...
However, in case I win the lottery, try a few of these (or not if there are too many).
Chassis: Apart from the ESA II gubbins, is the chassis noticeably different?
Technology: So, this ESA II looks awesome in theory, but this being BMW new-technology, from the company that brought us lots of great things but also that EVO servo-powered integrated braking system, two questions arise:
1. Does it actually "work" in the real world? Or is it
an expensive hi-tech downgrade from ESA I?
2. It's new BMW technology, let us cynically assume that
it is going to go wrong. What are the obvious possible
new failure modes, and will any of them hurt as much
as EVO brake failures do, either wallet-wise or
bodily?
Donk: So, 1300. On the GT, do you find yourself thinking "Thank christ for the extra grunt, the 1200 was lacking something"? Or is it perhaps even a retrograde step, trading slightly better Top Trumps power and top speed scores for real world poorer fuel consumption? With the ASC enabled, does the electronic nanny even let you use any of the extra power anyway?
Ergos: So, new switchgear and re-arranged clocks. Compared back to back, better or worse ergos on the new bike? Also, the new switchgear is supposedly of a new solid state design; forget the ergonomics for a moment, do the new switches look or feel cheap and nasty compared with the old school klicky analogue items etc?
Quote:
We're riding from Malaga to Faro, so a decent gig. The S and R will also be there to ride.
Oh excellent!
Are you going to get any time to ride any of the bikes on your own, away from the BMW press minders, when you get to Faro? Or can you persuade any of them to go native for a few hours? If so, I have arguably one of the best biking roads in the world to offer you.
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=d&sa...e=UTF8&z=10
The N2 is pretty bloody brilliant, but you turn off that and onto the EN124 to Cachopo which is just awesome. The best road I've ever ridden, full stop. Although I did it in July, in blazing sunshine, so lets hope it isn't pissing down when you are there. Just look at the terrain, if you want to know how good it is!
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=d&sa...mp;t=h&z=13
There's basically only one way there from Faro, so if you stick 'Cachopo' into your fancy BMW GPS, that's the way it will send you. Cachopo is a nice little Spaghetti Western town in the mountains, with a decent roadside cafe-restaurant there that does good grub.
I'm sure that my ex-pat mate who lives in Faro would be more than happy to act as a guide/translator and show you the way at speed, if that helps. He's pretty handy with a camera as well, if that is any use. PM or email me if you'd like me to put you in touch...
Quote:
All assuming the 650GS story hasn't got me declared persona non grata of course...
Ha! They wouldn't be that crass, I'm sure. They'll smile and be very nice, even if they have to do it through gritted teeth. In due course, when they are doing the fork recall and the damage limitation exercise that surely must follow at some point*, they will probably even have to publically thank you "for bringing this matter to our attention"...
Of course, shortly after that, you will probably wake up one morning face down in the canal after a chance meeting outside a pub at chucking out time with some ex-Stasi agents, but that will just be sheer bad luck... 
*Ask Wayne about Jim Tussey; they are in contact apparently.
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hubb/which-bike/has-anybody-ever-seen-failure-38514-4#post213501
I'm told that he went and had a full independant metallurgical study and analysis done at his own expense, so concerned was he, even though he believed BMW when they told him that his was a "one off". I hear tell (though I'm no longer taking an active interest in developments) that the analysis makes very interesting reading.
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Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
Quote:
Hey Ken, you're back. Good.
I'll second that.
Thanks, chappers! As I say, good to be back.
Group Hug?
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Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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xxrider
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 07/11/2006
Posts: 2604
Loc: Somewhere over the rainbow.......
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Group Hug, Huh? You'll excuse me if I pass - although I suppose a virtual hug means no embarrasing bodily odours or alcohol breath, so I may join in......
So, whereya been? Did Santa stop at the Haylock residence, and leave that 5'6" slim blonde you asked for?
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Remember - there are people in the world who are only alive because it's illegal to shoot them.
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Brigadoon
old hand
Reged: 24/09/2008
Posts: 932
Loc: Down and to the right a bit...
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Welcome back Ken! *group huggin*
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
Group Hug, Huh? You'll excuse me if I pass - although I suppose a virtual hug means no embarrasing bodily odours or alcohol breath, so I may join in......
So, whereya been? Did Santa stop at the Haylock residence, and leave that 5'6" slim blonde you asked for?
Nah, I just became more misanthropic and jaded than usual for a while, and got out of the habit of looking at the forum. Small things like the self-destruction of the economy and its incipient impact on yours truly rather stole my attention there for a while... 
I've decided not to worry about it though. Either business picks up in the next three months, which will be nice, or I pull the plug, cash out and spend the remainder of the recession trundling round the world on my bike, watching the collapse of western civilisation from somewhere with decent weather, cheap beer and good roads.
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Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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chappers
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 31/12/2006
Posts: 6701
Loc: Mind your own business
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Quote:
Either business picks up in the next three months, which will be nice, or I pull the plug, cash out and spend the remainder of the recession trundling round the world on my bike, watching the collapse of western civilisation from somewhere with decent weather, cheap beer and good roads.
Sounds like a plan and basis of a book. 
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Say what you think and think what you say.
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xxrider
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 07/11/2006
Posts: 2604
Loc: Somewhere over the rainbow.......
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Quote:
I pull the plug, cash out and spend the remainder of the recession trundling round the world on my bike, watching the collapse of western civilisation from somewhere with decent weather, cheap beer and good roads.
So, getting a job with Superbike Mag, then?
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Remember - there are people in the world who are only alive because it's illegal to shoot them.
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
So, getting a job with Superbike Mag, then?
I know that Kenny has been holding a lucrative slot open with my name on it just in case I became available, and I also know that he will be gutted if I decline the opportunity and will have to find another fat hairy middle-aged computer consultant (who can't write to length) to complete the Superbike all-star editorial line-up, but... err... no :-).
There are several reasons for this. Only one of them is that if I cash out and hit the road, I probably don't want to wash up in Croydon, lovely though it is (on one or two days of the year. Possibly. If you have taken a lot of really good drugs).
Edit: Croydon. In a serious recession. Tempting. Very tempting...
Edited by KwH (03/01/2009 19:32)
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shinybusa
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/01/2008
Posts: 1989
Loc: away with the fairies..
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I want SANTA sacked.......
I asked for Xmas for NO really long posts, with really long words in, ESPECIALLY the one's posted by KWH!!!!!!!!!
Welcome back fella!!!!!
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
Welcome back Ken! *group huggin*
I'll have a group hug with you any day of the week, my dear :-)
--------------------
Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
I want SANTA sacked.......
I asked for Xmas for NO really long posts, with really long words in, ESPECIALLY the one's posted by KWH!!!!!!!!!
Welcome back fella!!!!!
Ha!
Cheers, mate...
--------------------
Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
I'm on the K1300GT launch in a fortnight.
Al, excellent write-up mate!
I gather that your vibe is that the 1300 engine really is worth the capacity hike? I'm pleasantly surprised. Although a nicer, 'snickier' gearbox would be nice, I thought they passed the 'minimum acceptable threshold' level a few years ago with the launch of the R1200GS, and every improvement since has just been gravy...
I'm also very heartened to read that the ESA-II thing really works in the real world! Big up to the BMW massive.
I can quite believe that you don't want to poke them with another sharp stick so soon by asking what might go wrong with it, but I have to say that much as I love the clever innovative stuff that BMW do, I object to their recent penny-pinching behaviour (which can't have saved much money - things like using wank fasteners and not delivering their new bikes with a full tool kit any more), but the thing I hate most is being an unpaid beta tester of BMW's innovations, especially safety critical ones! Especially when they have a very teutonic corporate culture that results in them never admitting mistakes even when they make obvious engineering fuck-ups!
As examples, I quote the now infamous F650GS forks, the version 1 Servo assisted brakes and also the K1200 air-box problems (my GT now has version 3 of the airbox retrofitted because I knew enough to ask BMW UK technical management about it at the NEC in 2007 and discovered that I could have the upgrade fitted free if I asked for it; it fixed my problem entirely and no doubt improved my life expectancy in the process, so why isn't it a proper recall for all those people who don't spend their time on the internet?).
Questions that remain unanswered then:
The new switchgear; hurrah for the end of stupid indicators, but my first impression from looking at the photos I've seen of the new switchgear is that it looks (feels??) cheap and nasty compared to the solid looking and feeling stuff it replaces.
I read somewhere that the new stuff isn't traditionally mechanical in the way that the old switchgear was, and that should make it more reliable than what is fitted to my GT (on its second left-hand switch cluster), but I don't see that it actually needs to look and feel cheap and tacky if that is what indeed it does...
No need to ask 'Does it wheelie' - that shot of you hoisting the GT is extremely impressive! Does 1300 make that much difference to the big lump's wheelie prowess or is it all down to your incredible skill?
But... what was the launch gift?
And finally, did you discover any particularly good roads in the Algarve that I can try next time I'm over there or recommend to my mate in the meantime?
--------------------
Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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adowds
old hand
Reged: 21/11/2006
Posts: 749
Loc: Croydon
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Hey mate,
The switches are cool - the argument they gave us was that they were running out of space for all the thing they need - ESA, ASC, ABS, grips, seat, cruise, info - they all need a button. SO that's why they have normal indicators - it cuts the real estate needed in half.
The technical difference is, I believe, that the contacts and wires are now effectively 'printed' onto the plastic shell of the switch unit. So there aren't wires crimped into contacts that are screwed into the shell like on old gear.
No launch gift, the GT is pretty easy to loft with a snatch of the wrist, and we spent more time in Spain than Portugal - we only really rode the motorway from the border to the hotel. But it was all very pleasant!
As to the fault tolerance of the ESA II, I guess the main difference (over ESA I) is the Elastogran sleeve, and I can't see how any failure here would render the shock unsafe or inoperable. It's just a stepper motor that moves a sleeve in or out, allowing the Elastogran to deform more or less, and thus giving a stiffer or softer section of spring. If it broke, it would just leave the spring rate as it is with the sleeve in that position.
Al
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KwH
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1896
Loc: Carmarthen, Dyfed
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Quote:
Hey mate,
SO that's why they have normal indicators - it cuts the real estate needed in half.
Nothing to do with them having finally found a face-saving way of ditching their long-standing pointless affectation without admitting that it has been stupid for the last 25 years, then?
Quote:
The technical difference is, I believe, that the contacts and wires are now effectively 'printed' onto the plastic shell of the switch unit. So there aren't wires crimped into contacts that are screwed into the shell like on old gear.
Cool!!! It looks like it might be a bit rubbish in the picture, and reading the leaked blurb about the internal changes, I had wondered whether the feel would be more 'rubber key spectrum or cheapo pocket calculator' than 'Vorksprung Duch Technik'. Glad to hear otherwise!
Quote:
No launch gift,
The credit crunch bites where it hurts most, clearly! Very BMW, though - fly the world's motorcycle press in to thrape millions of euros worth of expensive hardware across the Spaghetti Western bit of Spain and into Portugal, feeding and watering them lavishly en-route, but save on the launch budget by not handing out the obligatory shapeless BMW T-shirt of legend...
Obviously you'll be giving the whole range a shocking write-up in the magazine, as a result of this unacceptable parsimony ...
Quote:
the GT is pretty easy to loft with a snatch of the wrist,
Wow! Wheelies of the throttle? I'd like to tell you whether my K1200GT will do that or not, but I have no idea since I've never tried and I'm not about to! The front has never come up by accident, though... will it lift on the 1300?
By the way, the 1300GT definitely looks better - they've put that ridiculous and obviously cosmetic scoop on the side, but it does the job of breaking up that big slab-sided expanse very well...
Quote:
and we spent more time in Spain than Portugal - we only really rode the motorway from the border to the hotel. But it was all very pleasant!
Ah, the border! You'd have come this way, then, over the bridge?
Quote:
I can't see how any failure here would render the shock unsafe or inoperable.
That's cool, I only asked because you will have had the big geek lecture and looked at the cutaway models up close and personal.
Talking of spendies, you mention that they've done something to the Hossack front end. Have they improved feel? A slight lack of front end feel is really my only criticism of the GT handling...
Finally, and not blowing smoke up BMW's arse because they have built some complete turkeys well within living memory and are still doing some things that reflect very poorly on them as a company, but BMW have built a superbly equipped two-up all-weather all-day pan-continental touring motorcycle that can be ridden by anybody from 5 foot tall to 6'5" (Seriously, the optional low seat on the lowest sitting will work for dwarves), does 50mpg all day, but will also do 160mph up the Autobahn and scratch round nadgery mountain roads at least as well as many sports tourers... I mean really, what else comes close right now? Neither the FJR nor the GTR can compete on either overall performance or touring pretensions, and neither can the Honda Pan, come to think of it!
--------------------
Ken Haylock
http://www.cix.co.uk/~kwh
"Ride what you like, how you like, as often as you like; but always take responsibilty for your actions." - Anonymous Zen Guru
"Obviously all I'll care about is if it's good for wheelies (i.e. fluffs up my meagre skills), and what free gift they give on the launch." - Anonymous Moto-Journalism Guru
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